2025-05-12 - Marketing Team Minutes

djacu · May 12, 2025, 6:03pm

Marketing Team meeting 2025-05-12

Attendance

Sync
Async

Previous Tasks

@avocadoom will look at adding author metadata
@avocadoom and @flyfloh work on the landing page PR together
@djacu will continue to work on branding

Agenda

Author metadata
Landing page PR
Redesign doc
Website
Newsletter
Branding

Minutes

Author metadata
- @avocadoom is there anything else we want to add like email?
- @djacu how about a handle?
- @avocadoom like a discourse handle?
- @djacu yeah we use it elsewhere on the website like for teams.
Landing page PR
- @avocadoom will talk with @flyfloh and assist him with the PR.
Redesign doc
- @djacu we were still waiting for who to comment? Oh right community post!
- @idabzo I will comment that we are still waiting for feedback and will wrap up the thread in 1 week or do you think we should wrap up now?
- @avocadoom I think people will be angry if we wrap up right now.
- @idabzo Okay 1 more week then.
Website
- @djacu any other website topics?
- @avocadoom there was a PR I reviewed today that improved the installation commands but not much else.
Newsletter
- @idabzo working on an article that captures everything in May and will publish it in June.
Branding
- @djacu lots of progress this past week.
  - Big refactor to re-organize things.
    packagesFromDirectoryRecursive is amazing.
    No long need to pass individual derivations around but can use the recursive scopes.
    Removes a lot of repetition.
  - Found out that typst and typix do not produce deterministic PDF files.
  - Clearspace imagery is almost done.
- @avocadoom can we start using the new logos on the website now?
- @djacu give me one more week to make a better media kit

Tasks

@avocadoom I will assist @flyfloh with the landing page
@avocadoom I will add the discourse handle to the blog post metadata
@idabzo I will help @djacu with the copy for the branding guide
@idabzo I will work on the newsletter
@djacu I will make a more complete media kit for @avocadoom and the website.
@djacu I will contact the board about PR #1746

Backlog

@djacu will work on the banner post
@djacu will gradually begin planning the Survey 2025

repo link

drupol · May 12, 2025, 9:02pm

Found out that typst and typix do not produce deterministic PDF files.

Care to elaborate? I never had that issue and the Typst team made the Typst output reproducible quite a while ago.

djacu · May 14, 2025, 4:57am

Sure. To preface, they are effectively the same but not byte-for-byte equal. What tipped me off was seeing this message when trying to use --rebuild.

error: derivation ‘/nix/store/hfw047mh689zmhkfxqzlql7aa0cfcijk-nixos-branding-guide-0.1.0.drv’ may not be deterministic: output ‘/nix/store/32l2sg2dgls390s1ab2w739vigr9vyhj-nixos-branding-guide-0.1.0’ differs

So I reran the build with --keep-failed and compared the default output with the .check output like so.

diff <(strings guide.pdf) <(strings guide.check.pdf)

I found that the data under ExtGState was always in random order. It is a bunch of lines that look like this.

359,361d358
<       /gs3 44 0 R
<       /gs4 45 0 R
<       /gs2 43 0 R
363a361,363
>       /gs2 43 0 R
>       /gs3 44 0 R
>       /gs4 45 0 R
677d676
<       /gs0 48 0 R
679c678
<       /gs4 52 0 R
---
>       /gs0 48 0 R
680a680
>       /gs4 52 0 R
875a876
>       /gs4 59 0 R
878d878
<       /gs4 59 0 R
1111,1115d1110
<       /gs12 74 0 R
<       /gs4 66 0 R
<       /gs11 73 0 R
<       /gs0 62 0 R
<       /gs10 72 0 R

This also causes the metadata and ID field under the trailer to be different.

< " id="W5M0MpCehiHzreSzNTczkc9d"?><x:xmpmeta xmlns:x="adobe:ns:meta/" x:xmptk="xmp-writer"><rdf:RDF xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#"><rdf:Description rdf:about="" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"  xmlns:xmp="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/"  xmlns:xmpMM="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/mm/"  xmlns:xmpTPg="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/t/pg/"  xmlns:pdf="http://ns.adobe.com/pdf/1.3/" ><xmp:CreatorTool>Typst 0.13.1</xmp:CreatorTool><xmpMM:DocumentID>icpaYlmcOQasYe+o+lxrYQ==</xmpMM:DocumentID><xmpMM:InstanceID>icpaYlmcOQasYe+o+lxrYQ==</xmpMM:InstanceID><dc:format>application/pdf</dc:format><pdf:PDFVersion>1.7</pdf:PDFVersion><dc:language><rdf:Bag><rdf:li>en</rdf:li></rdf:Bag></dc:language><xmpTPg:NPages>21</xmpTPg:NPages><xmpMM:RenditionClass>proof</xmpMM:RenditionClass></rdf:Description></rdf:RDF></x:xmpmeta><?xpacket end="r"?>
---
> " id="W5M0MpCehiHzreSzNTczkc9d"?><x:xmpmeta xmlns:x="adobe:ns:meta/" x:xmptk="xmp-writer"><rdf:RDF xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#"><rdf:Description rdf:about="" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"  xmlns:xmp="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/"  xmlns:xmpMM="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/mm/"  xmlns:xmpTPg="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/t/pg/"  xmlns:pdf="http://ns.adobe.com/pdf/1.3/" ><xmp:CreatorTool>Typst 0.13.1</xmp:CreatorTool><xmpMM:DocumentID>hhjbhuevHbRxGk/XhBoigw==</xmpMM:DocumentID><xmpMM:InstanceID>hhjbhuevHbRxGk/XhBoigw==</xmpMM:InstanceID><dc:format>application/pdf</dc:format><pdf:PDFVersion>1.7</pdf:PDFVersion><dc:language><rdf:Bag><rdf:li>en</rdf:li></rdf:Bag></dc:language><xmpTPg:NPages>21</xmpTPg:NPages><xmpMM:RenditionClass>proof</xmpMM:RenditionClass></rdf:Description></rdf:RDF></x:xmpmeta><?xpacket end="r"?>
7064c7064
<   /ID [(icpaYlmcOQasYe+o+lxrYQ==) (icpaYlmcOQasYe+o+lxrYQ==)]
---
>   /ID [(hhjbhuevHbRxGk/XhBoigw==) (hhjbhuevHbRxGk/XhBoigw==)]

I used qpdf to remove the metadata, linearize the PDF, and create a new deterministic trailer ID. That almost fixed it but the trailer ID was still different. The trailer ID has two IDs. The first is created upon PDF generation and never changes. The second is initially the same as the first but updates when the PDF changes. So after my fixes, the second ID matched but the first ID was still different. I then used cpdf to initially remove the trailer ID before passing it to qpdf to perform the same aforementioned fixes and then it was deterministic.

Modifications to typix can be found in this file.

github.com

NixOS/branding/blob/b3821badbf6344ca517be1767d661252c49e04c7/overlays/add-typix-library/overlay.nix

inputs:
let

  # inherits

  inherit (inputs.nixpkgs)
    lib
    ;

  inherit (lib.fixedPoints)
    composeManyExtensions
    ;

in

composeManyExtensions [

  (final: prev: {
    typix-lib = inputs.typix.lib.${final.stdenv.hostPlatform.system};
  })

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Where were added on this commit.

djacu · May 14, 2025, 5:01am

@loqusion you might be interested in the post above. Or maybe you can tell me about some really obvious option I forgot to enable.

drupol · May 14, 2025, 5:36am

Perhaps it is an issue with the document date ?

djacu · May 14, 2025, 5:52am

As I’ve shown in the post above, it is not an issue with the date. I had already added the following line to the top of my typst file to prevent the creation date being included in the output PDF.

#set document(date: none)

The problem is with how graphical attributes are added to the PDF. They should and could very easily be linearized but for some reason were not.

drupol · May 14, 2025, 6:03am

I’ll ping the Typst team today about that.

drupol · May 14, 2025, 6:04am

Could you provide a minimal Typst reproducer ?

djacu · May 14, 2025, 6:15am

This branch

Here is a permalink to the file

github.com

NixOS/branding/blob/1975727e53fe71da78d0b2a64bfc250a93320bcd/package-sets/top-level/nixos-branding/nixos-branding-guide/nixos-branding-guide.typ

// Date must be set to none for deterministic builds
#set document(date: none)
#set page("a4", flipped: true)
#set text(font: "Route 159")

#let sectionTitle(content, size: 36pt) = {
  upper(text(size: size, weight: "bold", content))
}

#let sectionPage(content, text_size: 36pt) = {
  page(
    margin: (x: 1cm, y: 0pt),
    background: align(right, image(
      "./miscellaneous/nixos-lambda-R512-T1_4-G0-none.svg",
      height: 100%,
    )),
    layout(size => {
      let text_content = sectionTitle(size: text_size)[#content]
      let text_size = measure(text_content)
      let text_start = 5 / 9 * size.height - text_size.height / 2

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to build the guide the first time

nix build .#nixos-branding.nixos-branding-guide

to keep the output when you try to rebuild

nix build .#nixos-branding.nixos-branding-guide --rebuild --keep-failed

*Edit: It needs to be built with Nix because it pulls in images from derivations. Trying to build the typst document by itself will not work.

I’d give you files but I cannot upload anything besides image and video files to discourse.

drupol · May 14, 2025, 6:19am

Do you think you could provide a simpler document without images (or other resources) where the issue could be reproduced?

djacu · May 14, 2025, 6:25am

The issue is with imagery. I could prepare a test repository with imagery.

drupol · May 14, 2025, 6:35am

That would help indeed! Thank you.

djacu · May 15, 2025, 2:28am

Here is a test repo.

nix develop to get typst.
./compare.sh to build the pdf twice and compare the outputs
You should see an about similar to this, but slightly different because the order of the gsX elements is random.

 ./compare.sh 
366a367
>       /gs3 29 0 R
367a369
>       /gs2 28 0 R
370,371d371
<       /gs2 28 0 R
<       /gs3 29 0 R
732c732
< " id="W5M0MpCehiHzreSzNTczkc9d"?><x:xmpmeta xmlns:x="adobe:ns:meta/" x:xmptk="xmp-writer"><rdf:RDF xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#"><rdf:Description rdf:about="" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"  xmlns:xmp="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/"  xmlns:xmpMM="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/mm/"  xmlns:xmpTPg="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/t/pg/"  xmlns:pdf="http://ns.adobe.com/pdf/1.3/" ><xmp:CreatorTool>Typst 0.13.1</xmp:CreatorTool><xmpMM:DocumentID>CyVHA/nHWS/eH3VMhJoKZQ==</xmpMM:DocumentID><xmpMM:InstanceID>CyVHA/nHWS/eH3VMhJoKZQ==</xmpMM:InstanceID><dc:format>application/pdf</dc:format><pdf:PDFVersion>1.7</pdf:PDFVersion><dc:language><rdf:Bag><rdf:li>en</rdf:li></rdf:Bag></dc:language><xmpTPg:NPages>6</xmpTPg:NPages><xmpMM:RenditionClass>proof</xmpMM:RenditionClass></rdf:Description></rdf:RDF></x:xmpmeta><?xpacket end="r"?>
---
> " id="W5M0MpCehiHzreSzNTczkc9d"?><x:xmpmeta xmlns:x="adobe:ns:meta/" x:xmptk="xmp-writer"><rdf:RDF xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#"><rdf:Description rdf:about="" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"  xmlns:xmp="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/"  xmlns:xmpMM="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/mm/"  xmlns:xmpTPg="http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/t/pg/"  xmlns:pdf="http://ns.adobe.com/pdf/1.3/" ><xmp:CreatorTool>Typst 0.13.1</xmp:CreatorTool><xmpMM:DocumentID>5wTrGohFrTk9OU2BzWw3WQ==</xmpMM:DocumentID><xmpMM:InstanceID>5wTrGohFrTk9OU2BzWw3WQ==</xmpMM:InstanceID><dc:format>application/pdf</dc:format><pdf:PDFVersion>1.7</pdf:PDFVersion><dc:language><rdf:Bag><rdf:li>en</rdf:li></rdf:Bag></dc:language><xmpTPg:NPages>6</xmpTPg:NPages><xmpMM:RenditionClass>proof</xmpMM:RenditionClass></rdf:Description></rdf:RDF></x:xmpmeta><?xpacket end="r"?>
797c797
<   /ID [(CyVHA/nHWS/eH3VMhJoKZQ==) (CyVHA/nHWS/eH3VMhJoKZQ==)]
---
>   /ID [(5wTrGohFrTk9OU2BzWw3WQ==) (5wTrGohFrTk9OU2BzWw3WQ==)]

If you comment out line 42:

  #image("./nixos-lambda-dimensioned-linear.svg")

And run the compare.sh script again, you should see no output meaning the files are the same.

djacu · May 15, 2025, 2:31am

I even tried reducing the main.typ file down to just this:

// Date must be set to none for deterministic builds
#set document(date: none)
#set page("a4", flipped: true)

#image("./nixos-lambda-dimensioned-linear.svg")

and it still compiles differently each time.

drupol · May 15, 2025, 11:55am

I’ve been told that this issue might have been fixed upstream, I will see if I can test this during the weekend. Tip: they have a flake in their repo if you feel like testing it by yourself in the meantime.

djacu · May 17, 2025, 3:33am

This has certainly been fixed upstream! It even fixes some new inconsistencies I found when adding new SVG files. Thanks for investigating this @drupol. I’ll be happy to upgrade once they cut a new release.